Profound

[nschmelzer]

Wang Xiangzhai: What is, after all, the basic principle of combat science? Different people have different answers to this question, but studying boxing routines, forms of movements, fixed techniques, and training hits and beats, all fall into the category of superficial, and although the boxing routines and forms of movements have been popular already for a long time, they are, indeed, extremely harmful to the people.

Wang Xiangzhai: Combat science cannot be divided into schools, and the boxing theory does not have the distinction of Chinese or foreign, and new or old. Do nothing but examine whether it is right or wrong, and suitable or unsuitable, that is enough. At large, the numerous schools of our society, generally take the approach of forms and techniques to learn boxing. One must know that this kind practice is just forgery conducted by the later generations, it is not the original essence of combat science. Even though a few people by chance realise some side-mechanics and one-sided techniques, they have not, however, left the methods and forms after all, so it is without avail in the end.

Wang Xiangzhai: The human body has all kinds of functions; no wise man can exhaust them all even if practising all his life. What is the reason to abandon the essence and study the scum? The more one studies the methods of forms and routines the ****her one will be from the truth. That is like binding the feet of the women, the more profound one’s skill is, the more difficult it is to extend the feet, therefore the beginners advance much faster than the veterans. This argument has been proved by many irrefutable examples. The theory created by the later generations where a certain posture breeds a certain strength, and a certain method overcomes a certain boxing skill is real magniloquence resulting in deceiving the people. I am afraid that the one who claims such things has no understanding of boxing at all.


How do Master Wang's statements relate to wing chun? Is the wing chun elbow position and punch, and stances, forgeries? Critics of WC claim that the WC theories and practice all go out the window in a real combat situation (and even in an MMA sporting situation). If that is true, what is left? Personally, I believe in the gate theory, elbow theory, centerline theory, simultaneous attack/defend theory, chi sau, kiu sau, chi kiu progression. I use the jong sau, chin gum sau, and biu sau in live situations. Any comments?

[t_niehoff]

How do Master Wang's statements relate to wing chun?

Quite frandkly, I don't care what Wang says. I reach my own conclusions based on my own experience.

Is the wing chun elbow position and punch, and stances, forgeries? Critics of WC claim that the WC theories and practice all go out the window in a real combat situation (and even in an MMA sporting situation). If that is true, what is left? Personally, I believe in the gate theory, elbow theory, centerline theory, simultaneous attack/defend theory, chi sau, kiu sau, chi kiu progression. I use the jong sau, chin gum sau, and biu sau in live situations. Any comments?

What you believe is not meaningful. People can beleive all kinds of stuff (for example, that they can fire chi balls at you). What matters is what you can do (in fighitng), and the level at which you can do it (the skill/attributes of your opponent). What you can do is true, the rest is merely theory.

[Hendrik]

Wang Xiangzhai: The human body has all kinds of functions; no wise man can exhaust them all even if practising all his life. What is the reason to abandon the essence and study the scum? The more one studies the methods of forms and routines the ****her one will be from the truth. That is like binding the feet of the women, the more profound one’s skill is, the more difficult it is to extend the feet, therefore the beginners advance much faster than the veterans. This argument has been proved by many irrefutable examples. The theory created by the later generations where a certain posture breeds a certain strength, and a certain method overcomes a certain boxing skill is real magniloquence resulting in deceiving the people. I am afraid that the one who claims such things has no understanding of boxing at all.


How do Master Wang's statements relate to wing chun? Is the wing chun elbow position and punch, and stances, forgeries? Critics of WC claim that the WC theories and practice all go out the window in a real combat situation (and even in an MMA sporting situation). If that is true, what is left? Personally, I believe in the gate theory, elbow theory, centerline theory, simultaneous attack/defend theory, chi sau, kiu sau, chi kiu progression. I use the jong sau, chin gum sau, and biu sau in live situations. Any comments?

IMHO, what WXZ said is direct to the target.

For example, the number one question when SLT/SNT was design will be how is this type of "structure" or Nature or Function sustain the frontal in comming force vectors.

if this issue is not resolve, disregard of which SLt/SNT practioners one is in trouble with frontal integrity of the structure under dynamaic attack such as a take down.



So, one could do tan sau or and more technics....to evolve thier SLT/SNt that still not solving the issue of this frontal sustain or neutralized...etc the frontal in comming force.



For me, when I mean Goes InternaL I mean to study, have a solution for the basic physical, mental... Nature or Function needed. It is not style or different ways of doing things... it is direct into the target of "ok, how things is possible to be implement? "


The bottom line I keep brougt up the Emei 12 Zhuang is not only that the SLT Kuen Kuit I know do "copy " the Emei 12 Zhuang writing, but to drive into the core to observe how is SLT possible/suppose to handling simple thing such as the frontal in comming force naturally without lip service. IE drop a ball from 12 floor it is going to go down no matter what theory one is Lip servicing or trying to explain one's way out. IE: if one clamp one's butt and hip tightly in the YJKYM , one sure "break" one's body into two part--- lower and upper body, and has to use lots of muscle power to sustain the incomming force because the hip joins has been locked. that is just nature. is that effective? could this stance rooted effortlessly? could this stance flow with ease while in action as needed? nope, that is just nature.

As what the Emei 12 Zhuang provide in the case of the SLT is the training of manualling or handling the spine and other part of body almost Join by Join, and with this type of handling, one knows, has a much greater chances to sustain or neutralize or slip away instead of head on collision compare with the other training such as CLF or HungGa or other "hard " style which rely more muscular power then WCK.

Thus, there is nothing Profound but we need to cover the basic with simplicity. that is what I mean internal.

Who cares how the explicit look of the move or how many sets one drill or what theory...ect? focus on the basic handling and simplicity IMHO. until that could be attained how could one even impliment the most basic? IMHO

Best regards