Gracie Beach streetfight

[kal]

The other guy in that video was Hugo Duarte - a very good Brazillian fighter in his own right.

[PangQuan]

so should we correctly label this vid


"clash of the ego's"

??

[Dragon Warrior]

xcakid

You are a moron!

[xcakid]

xcakid

You are a moron!

Not the first time I have been called that. However.....

Here's a couple of streetfights that have been posted on this forum. And bear in mind. This is lacking another element in most street fights. Guns and knives.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW_cn...elated&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyokcLPl8wM

Based on what was posted on this thread regarding the "realities of a streetfight" that the Gracies claim, how will that be effective? So can you elaborate why you find me mornic? Or do you just feel like saying that cause I hit a nerve?

Seems you train in BJJ. Elaborate on you training regarding street fights. I would be willing to bet that majority of your training is with one on one sparring method. Sure that conditions you for an actual fight. Again I do not contest the fact the BJJ is hands down the best in that. Your school may train differently, but 100% of the BJJ schools I have witnessed train is one on one ring style fighting.

Ever heard of the saying "train how your fight, fight how you train"?

[Dragon Warrior]

Not the first time I have been called that. However.....

Here's a couple of streetfights that have been posted on this forum. And bear in mind. This is lacking another element in most street fights. Guns and knives.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW_cn...elated&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyokcLPl8wM

Based on what was posted on this thread regarding the "realities of a streetfight" that the Gracies claim, how will that be effective? So can you elaborate why you find me mornic? Or do you just feel like saying that cause I hit a nerve?

Seems you train in BJJ. Elaborate on you training regarding street fights. I would be willing to bet that majority of your training is with one on one sparring method. Sure that conditions you for an actual fight. Again I do not contest the fact the BJJ is hands down the best in that. Your school may train differently, but 100% of the BJJ schools I have witnessed train is one on one ring style fighting.

Ever heard of the saying "train how your fight, fight how you train"?

You didnt hit a nerve, you are just so ignorant about martial arts and fighting that it bothers me that you have the right to state your opinion. You obviously have been brainwashed by a cult leader and have never trained effectively for a real fight.

But whatever, believe what you want to believe. Keep training to defeat multiple attackers. Hopefully one day you will be able to test what you have been taught and after you get your ass kicked you can thank your sifu for taking your money and teaching you bull****.

[Knifefighter]

Seems you train in BJJ. Elaborate on you training regarding street fights. I would be willing to bet that majority of your training is with one on one sparring method.

To train to fight against multiple opponents, one must supplement standard BJJ training with training that specifically addresses that issue, both standing and on the ground. Same with weapons.

Working against multiple opponents has some interesting paradoxes. One of them is that open space for movement is your friend when you are standing, but your enemy when you are on the ground.

[Mega-Foot]

That's an interesting paradox. I also find that to hold true. I would also add that weapons adhere to the same paradox. When you have a weapon, it is your friend. When you don't have one, weapons are your enemy.

[Mega-Foot]

That made me laugh.

[xcakid]

But whatever, believe what you want to believe. Keep training to defeat multiple attackers. Hopefully one day you will be able to test what you have been taught and after you get your ass kicked you can thank your sifu for taking your money and teaching you bull****.

Dude, apparently you did not read my post completely before going on the offensive. I don't claim to train to defeat multiple attackers. Matter of fact my whole outlook on MA seems to differ than most on this board. In a streetfight, I would probably draw my knife or firearms and get the f-ck out dodge. I am not gonna stay there and slug it out like I was in my dojo/kwoon/ring.

I just said, and please read, that most of the styles I have been involved with addressed on TACTICS, EVADING and perhaps SURVIVING multiple attackers. This was done by occassionally sparring with mulitple attackers both with and without weapons. The other point I was making is that I have never seen a BJJ school that even dealt or touched on this subject. It seems that most (I am not saying all since I have not seen all schools) BJJ schools train on one on one ring or tournament style fighting. This whole thing stemmed from the comment on the video posted claiming the realities of a street fight. I disagree with that comment that a street fight is what was being depicted in that video. That is a BS streetfight. That is basically a ring fight done outdoors. And if you buy into that, I wish you good luck as well, should you come across a REAL streetfight.

And perhaps there is truth in my "ignorance". My only involvement I have had in BJJ is what I have seen in various schools I have observed over the years and a few friends that are taking or have taken the art. However, based on everything I have seen, so far my conclusions have been that:

1) Probably the best ring/tournament style out there
2) Will be very effective in a one on one fight
3) Like most MA out there, severely lacking in street concepts.
4) Severely lacking in the other aspects of TMA. For example the internal arts aspects of it. Or the softer side of it. How many here will still be doing BJJ at age 70?

[rogue]

Working against multiple opponents has some interesting paradoxes. One of them is that open space for movement is your friend when you are standing, but your enemy when you are on the ground.

Ah, but a choke point against multiples is a gift.

[Dragon Warrior]

1) Probably the best ring/tournament style out there
2) Will be very effective in a one on one fight
3) Like most MA out there, severely lacking in street concepts.
4) Severely lacking in the other aspects of TMA. For example the internal arts aspects of it. Or the softer side of it. How many here will still be doing BJJ at age 70?

BJJ never claimed to be effective against multiple attackers.

What street concepts are you talking about? Seriously, if my Jiujitsu teacher practiced an ATM Mugging Drill or something like that, I would laugh. That is just not what Jiujitsu guys are into. I pay to learn grappling, I dont want some army ranger teaching me how to defend against multiple attackers with knives.

Of course there are going to be factors in the street that you wont see in the gym. But the most important thing is the resistance training. Grappling and Sparring are the best ways to prepare yourself for any fight. If you dont have experience sparring or grappling against resisting opponents then you might as well be dancing or taking yoga.

You have never trained in BJJ so you dont understand the depth of the art. It is the fastest growing martial art in the world because modern technology has allowed people to see what is trully effective in a fight.

[rogue]

BJJ never claimed to be effective against multiple attackers.

But there is the habit by some BJJ luminaries to say about any weak point in BJJ that it can't be done.

[golden arhat]

A number of schools mass attack train.

yeah like mine

tbh i really dislike the bjj type take downs they really open you up for sweeps and manouvering i like the simplicity of wrestling takedowns better

i didnt think that was in anyway realistic
i'm surprised if hickson didnt have friends with him (filming the event) why they didn't jump in

not to bash bjj

bjj has done a lot of good


however everything traditional or modern should be taken with a pinch of salt

[xcakid]

BJJ never claimed to be effective against multiple attackers.

What street concepts are you talking about?

True, but based on the video posted it seems the Gracies are claiming it is the end all be all in street fight. That is the point I am calling BS!! Streetfight more often than not becomes a multiple attacker type fight as the example of the videos I referenced and many other fights I have witnessed.

Conditioning in learning to defend or evade multiple attackers. Such as learning to stack your opponents. Looking for opening or making an opening so that you can run. Learning on when to be offensive or defensive(which is BS cause I believe in a streetfight there is no defense. Just offense. You get defensive and you get hurt)

I also augment my MA with firearms training. Learning to use cover. Engaging multiple targets. I am fortunate enough to live in TX where we can legally carry a concealed firearm. So I make it a point, when finances permit, to take tactical firearms courses. And also shoot competitions on a frequent basis to keep up with reflexes.

Another thing I do, although not actively, is train in Arnis for my weapons training.

I am not claiming that I will be 100% effective in the street, but I am confident enough that I can at least evade or last long enough for the cops to show up.

Of course there are going to be factors in the street that you wont see in the gym. But the most important thing is the resistance training. Grappling and Sparring are the best ways to prepare yourself for any fight. If you dont have experience sparring or grappling against resisting opponents then you might as well be dancing or taking yoga.

Yep. I whole heartedly agree. One of the reasons why I stay away from schools that have an emphasis on point sparring or forms and no full contact sparring including take downs. There should be a good balance of forms work, sparring, and physical development.

You have never trained in BJJ so you dont understand the depth of the art. It is the fastest growing martial art in the world because modern technology has allowed people to see what is trully effective in a fight.

Nope I don't. I am ignorant in the entire art itself, I admit that. I am basing my opinion on what I have seen and what friends experience that are taking or have taken.

[PangQuan]

if i am going to be a jerk and attack someone on the streets, be it for mugging, hatecrime, just to watch the man die, etc...

if i were to actually do this type of activity, you can bet your ass 100% i will pull at weapon, likely a blade.

if we are talking urban struggles against 2 people who have prior history, know each other, hold grudges, etc. i dont consider that a street fight.

it removes itself from the element of unexpectedness, under the idea that you have previous knowledge about your opponent.

the video we saw was NOT a street fight.

it was a gracie BJJ video beach fight. its exactly what it looks like.

we are talking Brazil people. Brazil.

think about it. do you know how violent brazil really is? do you realize that brazil's murder rate is higher than that of the U.S.?

if that were a REAL street fight in brazil, you likely would have seen a blade and some blood. mass attacks by multiples and maybe a dead body.

this was a commercial for BJJ