pai lum history

[sayloc]

Anyone out there have any history on the pai lum forms?

[Shaolin Dude]

that system looks phony. look at the pics of the old sifu's

[Becca]

Originally posted by Shaolin Dude
that system looks phony. look at the pics of the old sifu's

What do you base that assumtion on?




Anywho...

There is much history behind the forms, but you'll play he!! getting it out of the Sifus. I know; I've tried. Usually you have to "earn" the knowledge. Those who have earned it will likely not give it to you just 'cause you asked.

[brothernumber9]

he probably bases it on the name pai lum

[sayloc]

Becca

I can give you any of the history of the forms you would like. I have a lot of the history, probably as much as some of your sifus if not more.

I was just looking for a little more on one particular form. Just trying to figure out what system they took it from.

Feel free to ask any quistions.

[Just a Guy]

Pai Lum may be eclectic, but I don't think it's "phony."

A colleague of mine is teaching a student who had studied Pai Lum for nine years, and my colleague recognized at least two of this student's forms as derived from traditional Shaolin.

The student was practicing a form out of Southern Snake that we call Leopard Fist, although in Pai Lum the form was apparently taught as a Leopard form (and not a Snake form).

The student was also practicing an old southern Shaolin five animal form.

Both of these forms had various alterations from the versions that my colleague was familiar with - but they were more or less the same forms. A common root was obvious. So I would conjecture that, at least somewhere along the way, Pai Lum took in some southern Shaolin material.

[brothernumber9]

I would guess that Pia Lum is an amalgamation of several different martial arts. I beleive Daniel K Pai was the system's founder, hence Pai Lum. However the name would still be odd since it would roughly mean "Pai Temple", and if the "Pai" part of it was not in reference to his name but more like "Pai" as in a system/family or grouping, it would be even stranger since then it would mean something akin to "Family Temple" or "System Temple". Nonetheless, every system started somewhere so at some point someone just "made it up" and named or refered to it in some way. If it works, it works and if it works it isn't phony.
at least as long as it is not trying to pass itslef off as something it is not.

[David Jamieson]

lum doesn't mean temple, it means "trees" or "forest" et al or it is a family name which does not mean trees. But rather is a surname. Either Lum or Lam are the spellings of the name.

Pai does mean "clan" or "style" or "family" etc. So, Pai lum in Cantonese would translate roughly to "family trees" or Pai as a surname as in dan pai, + Lum for whatever context it has to them. It might not even be a cantonese phonetic afterall.

Perhaps you are thinking of teh word "shi" or "si" which mean temple in the phrase " Shao Lin Si"

Anyway, I see in their photos they do a hapkido stance a lot. So, could be a mix of Tae Kwon Do, or other Korean MA with a smidgen of Karate and probably some CMA extrapolated or gathered from here and there.

Not really that unusual when one talks about american martial arts. Also, There really aren't any "old" forms. All the forms we have today are pretty much modern interpretations with very very few exceptions.

Even in old and long lineages the forms change according to what is known in teh here and now. And tehy are adapted to the times for the most part. So what was down and how it was practiced 500 years ago simply isn't happening now. maybe a couple of generations of survival, but after that, they can't do anything but change to fit the changing world.

[Shaolin Dude]

I did see some of pai lum's forms and it definitely look traditional southern. the reason I said that because of that daniel k pai's pics. he looks phony

[Becca]

Originally posted by Shaolin Dude
I did see some of pai lum's forms and it definitely look traditional southern. the reason I said that because of that daniel k pai's pics. he looks phony

... If you say so. I try to base my oppinions on something more than a photo, though.

Pai does mean "clan" or "style" or "family" etc. So, Pai lum in Cantonese would translate roughly to "family trees" or Pai as a surname as in dan pai, + Lum for whatever context it has to them. It might not even be a cantonese phonetic afterall

To us, Pai Lum means "White Dragon." Take what you will from that.

Anyway, I see in their photos they do a hapkido stance a lot. So, could be a mix of Tae Kwon Do, or other Korean MA with a smidgen of Karate and probably some CMA extrapolated or gathered from here and there.

No direct Korean, to my knowledge, but Grand Master Pai was from Hawaii. I know from having lived there for 3 years that there is alot of Korean culture there, so that may be a possability. But yes, there is alot of Japanese influence. 70% of my Ninjitsu translates almost perfectly with Pai Lum teachings. I'm still a noob to CMA, so I have no clue when it comes to what parts are "pure".

[David Jamieson]

well, pai lum doesn't translate to "white dragon" in any language really that I can think of.

That would be "bok lung" Lung, loong, et al are the words for "dragon" in chinese. But not Lum and Pai as "white" would be stretching it even phonetically.

Anyway, I wouldn't worry to much about names, people can call stuff whatever they want to call it. Hanging on to all that superfluous stuff only means you are missing out on the real meaning of what you are doing or being taught to do.

But as Yip Man once said, and I paraphrase, it is good to know the source of the water from which you drink.

[Fu-Pow]

Bai Long would, however, translate to mean "white dragon."

Perhaps Pai Lum is just somebodies crappy romanization.

[David Jamieson]

i think they all it "pai" because of daniel pai, their main teacher, according to their site.

[Fu-Pow]

Maybe there teachers name was Pai X X. Is "White" a chinese last name?

[Ou Ji]

Pai Lum, the style, is named after Daniel K. Pai and it's Kenpo based so you should see a Japanese influence rather than Korean. The name of Glen Wilson's chain of schools is White Dragon. Most of the Kenpo in the U.S. came out of the Parker ranch in Hawaii (Ed Parker - American Kenpo, Professor K.S. Chow - Kara Ho Kenpo, Tracy Brothers - American Kenpo, Daniel K. Pai - Pai Lum). For some reason only Pai Lum went in the direction of Chinese Kung Fu while the rest fall in with the Karate crowd.