Shaolin confused

[kfson]

Is the Shaolin temple Buddhist or Zen?

Does the fact that the Shaolin temple is either Buddhist or Zen have any bearing on how one practices one's Shaolin kung fu?

What is the difference between Buddhist and Zen?

Is there a Zen Martial Art? If so, how is Buddhist martial art different from Zen martial art?

[MasterKiller]

Is the Shaolin temple Buddhist or Zen?

Does the fact that the Shaolin temple is either Buddhist or Zen have any bearing on how one practices one's Shaolin kung fu?

What is the difference between Buddhist and Zen?

Is there a Zen Martial Art? If so, how is Buddhist martial art different from Zen martial art?

Zen is a school of Mahāyāna Buddhism.

[kfson]

Zen is a school of Mahāyāna Buddhism.

OK, I googled Mahāyāna Buddhism. It appears that Buddhism is all over the playing field... different factions, large vehicles, small vehicles, etc.... Madhyamaka school, Gelugpa school, early Buddhist schools, Sarvāstivādins, Sautrāntikas, Yogācāra, and others.

Why isn't Buddha just Buddha?

[MasterKiller]

OK, I googled Mahāyāna Buddhism. It appears that Buddhism is all over the playing field... different factions, large vehicles, small vehicles, etc.... Madhyamaka school, Gelugpa school, early Buddhist schools, Sarvāstivādins, Sautrāntikas, Yogācāra, and others.

Why isn't Buddha just Buddha?

Because once he died, different students began teaching different lessons.

[David Jamieson]

OK, I googled Mahāyāna Buddhism. It appears that Buddhism is all over the playing field... different factions, large vehicles, small vehicles, etc.... Madhyamaka school, Gelugpa school, early Buddhist schools, Sarvāstivādins, Sautrāntikas, Yogācāra, and others.

Why isn't Buddha just Buddha?

For the same reason Jesus isn't just Jesus.

[kfson]

For the same reason Jesus isn't just Jesus.

That's what I was thinking.
Some consider a major part of Christianity to be heretical. Could this be so in Buddhism, also?

Because once he died, different students began teaching different lessons.

Are there different lessons and why should different schools of thought be formed around different lessons? Doesn't this sound incomplete in the Buddha sense or not? Just wondering.

[LFJ]

the different schools are just different flavors, different ways to practice that suit different people.

zen is "a special transmission outside the scriptures; not dependent on words and speech", which means although the tradition grew out of mahayana buddhism, and is still considered buddhist and uses buddhist scriptures as instructional tools, it really doesnt depend on buddhism.

its not about picking up new ideas, but putting everything down.

so zen and buddhism, are they the same or different?

if you say the same, you get hit thirty times.

if you say different, you get hit thirty times.

if you say both or neither, you get hit thirty times.

[David Jamieson]

That's what I was thinking.
Some consider a major part of Christianity to be heretical. Could this be so in Buddhism, also?


Are there different lessons and why should different schools of thought be formed around different lessons? Doesn't this sound incomplete in the Buddha sense or not? Just wondering.

yes.

On his death bed, Buddha pleaded to thin it all down and take it all back to the very basic message (deer park sermon and 8 fold path solution). This did not stop all te sects from popping up and interpreting what buddha said however they wanted to interpret it to suit the perspective of te teachings that their elders had. This is how tradition forms. Don't get me wrong, there is a lot of great information in the sutras and in dharma practice no matter the sect.

But we all have to have an identity and unfortunately, having an identity can outweigh the meaning of the identity in the first place all too often, this is due to a lack of mindfulness and an abundance of emotional excitement.

In all religions, there are plenty of texts which serve only to make things unclear. the more you chase the knowledge that is in them, the more you realize how it is incongruous, contradictory depending on what part you're reading and in many cases can be an outright conflict of ideas at play.

The religious hierarchy is not what is important. Neither is the teacher. What's important is how you live your life. What you do with your time here. How much love you can push into the world around you. How much help you can give. How much balance you can bring into your own life that allows you to do that.

Sometimes a lesson can be had and given at the same time. Not all lessons are positive experiences and some of the most positive events come out of the ashes of terrible things said and done.

Know yourself, and you know more than most.

[uki]

*munching popcorn* this sh!t is priceless...

[taai gihk yahn]

*munching popcorn* this sh!t is priceless...

seriously...

[YouKnowWho]

What is the difference between Buddhist and Zen?

I thought one only cares about himself 小乘 (Xiao Cheng), and the other care about others "大乘 (Da Cheng). Just like the tea party members who can't care less about whether others have health care or not. The democrat do care about that everybody should have health care.

[kfson]

I thought one only cares about himself 小乘 (Xiao Cheng), and the other care about others "大乘 (Da Cheng). Just like the tea party members who can't care less about whether others have health care or not. The democrat do care about that everybody should have health care.

???
One could argue that Republicans want everyone to have health care, but not socialized.
Socialized health care does not have a market on caring.

I'm not fast enough to see the relationship with Buddhism and Zen.

[Scott R. Brown]

The idea of 'skillful means' or presenting Buddhist teachings & practices in different ways to suit different individuals is certainly one of the factors behind the proliferation of Buddhist sects. And in this sense, it's important to understand that just because there are different sects or schools does not mean that the concept of heresy applies. In other words, it's not a zero sum game as it often is in the west. There's another, less noble factor as well though. Buddhism has always been a social as well as a spiritual phenomenon. Right from the start, and picking up major steam under the Indian emperor Ashoka, issues of patronage, politics & power have been injected into the sangha. Certainly this trend increased over time as Buddhism spread. As some monasteries became wealthy, powerful institutions they understandably found their focus on the dhamma either shifted or diluted. And this spurred counter-movements, or competing movements. The same thing continues to happen even today. You can see it in within the Thai Theravada tradition, and probably others as well.

Which brings to mind Bodhidharma's reply when the Emperor asked him what merits he has gained for ordaining monks, building temples, etc.

"None at all!"

[YouKnowWho]

I'm not fast enough to see the relationship with Buddhism and Zen.

There are 2 major branches of Buddhism.

- 小乘 (Xiao Cheng) is 出世 (Chu Shi) that you go to a temple and live there until you have saved yourself.
- 大乘 (Da Cheng) is 入世 (Ru Shi) that you go to the society and help others to be saved.

For example, 濟公 (Ji Gong) is 大乘 (Da Cheng) who tried to help as many people as he could.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zbVzgcWpPI

[Hendrik]

Is the Shaolin temple Buddhist or Zen?

Does the fact that the Shaolin temple is either Buddhist or Zen have any bearing on how one practices one's Shaolin kung fu?

What is the difference between Buddhist and Zen?

Is there a Zen Martial Art? If so, how is Buddhist martial art different from Zen martial art?

Buddhism is a general term.

Zen is a teaching in Buddhism.

Zen is the path where one was directly coaching to "see" one's Buddha nature. This is the advance teaching of Buddhism which is equavalent with the Esoteric Buddhism's MahaMudra teaching.

Not everyone can practice Zen. One needs to have a certain level of depth before Zen could benifit one. It is not about thinking, it is let go the thinking and enter into silence and recognize one's buddha nature.

After one recognize one's buddha nature, one know there is nothing out there but everything is a transformation of one's own buddha nature, a creation of one's mind. and mind is an instrument of creation or an application of the buddhanature.


Zen and Shao lin's connection comes from BoddhiDharma the Buddhist patriach who brought Zen teaching to China reside in Shao Lin. So, Zen was spread from Shao lin to other part of China. Shaolin is a Buddhist temple which is specialized in Zen however not everyone there practice Zen because Zen is an advance path.


Shao Lin has a term called Zen and Martial art is non dual. This term means one could use martial art as a vehicle to coach one to recognize one's buddhanature. This term also could be understood by after one sees one's buddha nature, one sees everything as the transformation of buddha nature.

Thus, this term means, before seeing one's buddha nature, one could use martial art as a vehicle, after one recognize one's buddha nature, everything is buddha nature. Thus, that is practicing Zen 24/7/12.


However, one must be careful that not everyone is capable to do the above because one needs a certain quality before one could walk this path.

That is where the other Buddhism path comes into play.

IE. the reciting of Amitaba Buddha teaching. As one sees the Shao Lin monks carry the recitation of Chanting beads. This teaching is for those who is not suitable to practice Zen directly, so, one uses this recitation teaching to build up the Samadhi or Stillness or peace in nature or upto a certain degree before they could practice Zen effectively. This teaching much more suitable for general public then Zen.


Now, some one might believe they could practice zen directly. in most cases, if one is not having the quality needed, one could spend a life time going no where with Zen.


Zen is 1/1000 human type of teaching, where the reciting of Amitaba Buddha is a 1000/1000 human type of teaching. so one needs to get into a proper teaching to be benifit.




Hope this help.