Xing Yi People: Power Delivery

[kfson]

In the 5 fists, do you deliver your punch simultaneous with your leading step or trailing step?

I recently had a discussion with a Xing Yi practitioner from another school who delivers with the leading while I use the trailing.

The body seems to be able to use spiral/torqueing energy and body mechanics more efficiently with rear step delivery. Also, the front foot does not need to be brought up as high and the stomping can be reduced. This seems to make the front foot stay closer to the ground in more of the Bagua tradition.

[chud]

Depends. For PiChuan (Splitting), I would say leading step.

[dimethylsea]

In the 5 fists, do you deliver your punch simultaneous with your leading step or trailing step?

I recently had a discussion with a Xing Yi practitioner from another school who delivers with the leading while I use the trailing.

The body seems to be able to use spiral/torqueing energy and body mechanics more efficiently with rear step delivery. Also, the front foot does not need to be brought up as high and the stomping can be reduced. This seems to make the front foot stay closer to the ground in more of the Bagua tradition.

Some bagua likes to emit maximum power with the leading step, just like xingyi or baji stereotypically do.

[kfson]

I will have to look into this further then.

[KTS]

u can train it either way. traditionally, the ending of the force issued is coordinated with the back leg's step.

depending on the situation though, i would change the timing to suit the situation. regardless, the follow up half step has various functions whichever way you prefer to coordinate it.

[cerebus]

"Hands and feet arrive at the same time" which I learned to mean that the front foot touches the ground as the striking hand makes contact with the opponent.

[kfson]

OK, I've been concentrating on the sequence of 1st step, fist, and 2nd step.
That is the sequence. Like a wave.
If the 1st step and the fist arrive at the same time, the tension of the body as an arched bow can not be released.

[KTS]

"Hands and feet arrive at the same time" which I learned to mean that the front foot touches the ground as the striking hand makes contact with the opponent.

so, do u carry out the rest of the movement as you sit on the back foot then? or is the half step, in your tradition, simply a following movement with purpose to recharge an attack and to keep balance?

i love to mix up practice. and, i have practiced and studied timing in every way possible. but historically, at least in my lineage, the ending of the action correlates to the back leg's half step.

[KTS]

anyways, for power delivery, there are a ton of things you have to study. angles, coordinating body movement, balance, direction of force, type of force, etc etc etc

so much that, whatever timing you use with your legs becomes kind of irrelevent in a way, as long as you remember the double weighting rules(same side, even weight, etc). some of ya know what i mean.

[cerebus]

The following-step takes place a a part of the whole technique, rather than being thought of as something separate (though at a beginning level it is referred to separately). The initial impact comes from the lead hand/ foot arriving at the same time with the full forward-moving bodyweight behind them, the following step continues the power and adds extra force to the initial impact while further "taking" the opponent's "space".

[KTS]

that is a good description, sounds about right to me.

Some bagua likes to emit maximum power with the leading step, just like xingyi or baji stereotypically do.

front leg weighting in xingyi is extremely momentary. the front foot coordinates with the beginning of an action, and the half step correlates with the ending of the action. at least in the hebei style zhang junfeng taught.

in a somewhat related point, the half step is even seen in boxing. but in boxing, the half step is only to maintain balance, and not used in conjunction with any application.

[kfson]

that is a good description, sounds about right to me.




front leg weighting in xingyi is extremely momentary. the front foot coordinates with the beginning of an action, and the half step correlates with the ending of the action. at least in the hebei style zhang junfeng taught.

in a somewhat related point, the half step is even seen in boxing. but in boxing, the half step is only to maintain balance, and not used in conjunction with any application.

This is what I'm getting.

I've tried many times to get the front foot and the hand to land at the same time, but it doesn't work for me. I will try to find an online vid of either.

[cerebus]

I've tried many times to get the front foot and the hand to land at the same time, but it doesn't work for me.

It takes practice...

[kfson]

Here is Hebei Xingyi by Liu Xiao Ling:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3XQI...eature=related

Note:
0:33
1:03
1:53

[kfson]

It takes p(r)actice...

I've tried both deliveries and have found almost a completely different generation of power in the two.