what have you seen?

[sanjuro_ronin]

I still don't know how the heck he did that. Later he told me that he just grabbed the tree BY ITS CHI

Fixed that for you

[Samurai Jack]

Fixed that for you

Oooooooooooooohhhh, IT'S CHI. Thank you sanjuro-san, it's so much clearer now!

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Hi Chris: There was bruising that covered about 6-8 inches in diameter and had began draining downward by the time Ms. Cui started her work.. the Dr. spent about 6-7 minutes poking and probing, rotating my leg and conceeding it was beyond the scope of on-site attention.. he was an MD.. the day after Ms. Cui worked on the leg the bruising had diminished to a barely noticable discoloration.. I am not a trained physician, EMT, or TCM practitioner.. i have been trained in Tui Na.. I walked like a rip, it hurt like a rip, it looked like a rip.. what's that they say about ducks? The Dr.'s advice was to get a complete medical evaluation when i got home..

Be well..

[sanjuro_ronin]

Oooooooooooooohhhh, IT'S CHI. Thank you sanjuro-san, it's so much clearer now!

Anytime !
As someone that advocates "the grabbing of the chi" I assure you all, it's a very practical technique !

[Yao Sing]

Are you referring to Dr. Lau?

I don't know his name but I guess that's him. The guy teaching the seminar in Shanghai that made his skin ripple and all that.

I ran over after the seminars ended since I wanted to see what he was all about and I had a pretty good understanding of the material I just learned.

When I got there he was demonstrating his ability to exert his Chi beyond his body. I know he already performed it on Lila and I motioned for him to do it to me as well. He did and although it was weaker (compared notes later with Lila) it was certainly real and not my imagination.

Now the interesting thing about this is something that I didn't realize until recently, many years later.

When he approached me I turned a bit offering my bad shoulder in the off chance that if it was real it might help the old injury. This old injury was from my last motorcycle accident where I almost lost the arm completely.

The anterior deltoid head is completely gone on my right shoulder. I used to have bouts of pain so intense I could only lay around and cry. It would last about an hour or two and I would be incapacitated during that time. The doctor I saw after moving to Florida said nothing can be done about it and I had to live with it.

Sometime last year (2007) I realized it's been so long since I got that pain I couldn't remember when it stopped or why. Then I was telling someone about the experience in Shanghai and it occured to me that I can't remember having that pain any time after the 1998 China trip.

I really wish I noticed sooner or paid more attention but it really seems like that might have ended it for me.

[wiz cool c]

Best example I have is an american Chen style tai chi teacher. His teacher's a well know chinese teacher in new york.

We used to so moving push hands the sumo type where you have to get the guy out of the circle. I have about 25 pounds on him ,we are the same hight. I never got him out of the circle and push with him maybe 100 times. He never exerted external force and always stayed relaxed.

If you saw this guy you would think he is really weak. But his strengh is increadible.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Hi Chris: I am with you on the analysis/understanding aspect.. finding the order and patterns in a process usually reveals a natural conclusion.. but, as i have found out, sometimes we simply can't put everything neatly into our boxes of knowledge.. suppose i tell you that, at one point during the treatment, Ms. Cui firmly pinched between 2nd and 3rd toes, on the foot/ball area (top and bottom) and lifted my entire body off the bed with nothing other than that pinch? i can safely recall being suspended for more than 1 to 1.5 seconds.. the situation was sufficient to cause Nelson to stand up and exclaim who knows what in Chinese.. sometimes we simply suspend rational analysis and embrace awe and wonder..

I have always sought logical and duplicatable explanations for "phenomena".. i understand "Qi" as bio-electric energy.. i understand that it can be enhanced and manipulated.. i understand that there are no prohibitions from a theoretical physics perspective that would discount "Qi balls" as some fantasize about.. i also understand i have never seen or experienced none of the mythical "Qi blasts", and i have no evidence to suggest that anyone has actually evolved to that level.. as Dave points out, i have seen stuff that defies logical explanation, and.. sometimes i am just pleased to be witness to human potential..

My current teacher exhibits qualities of "pushing" that seem incomprehensible, but.. after more than a year working with him, i am beginning to understand how his sensitivity is so superior, his ability to function at a heightened state of awareness, and his understanding of human-nature/mechanics is so finely tuned that he is simply expressing natural potential.. no magic, no mystical ritual, just an incredible depth of understanding how we function in various states of stimuli.. it's very cool, and.. he can actually transmit the knowledge..

Sometimes, it's okay to simply say, "wow, that's cool"..

Be well..

[TenTigers]

man, can't you guys take this to pm, or another thread?

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

just before I conjecture, can you describe the position your body was in in more detail?

I was laying flat on my back on a bed.

TenTigers: No. Well, we could, but.. it would break the flow of the dialogue.. Chris has some insight into injuries, so.. while i post my perspective of "what i have seen", Chris might be able to share a more beneficial perspective.. unless, of course, the intent of the thread is to only look at unexplainable stuff..

Be well..

[TenTigers]

the intent of the thread was more in connection to TMA, but healing is part of the big picture so...have at it.

[Bob Ashmore]

I haven't seen the fight of the century between two internalists, if that's what you're asking for, but what I have seen come out of Tai Chi Chuan training over the last six years in my current school has been pretty awesome.
What I've seen have been many more incidents of really cool healing than of highly skillful dueling, so I can only tell you about those.
I've watched a woman go from barely being able to walk due to spinal injuries to beginning to learn the kicks and spins of the long form. She did this in about two years. I personally have gone from barely being able to use my left arm due to a cervical spine injury to having nearly full use of it again, after I'd been told by medical "experts" that I would not be able to do so. There are many other stories of people learning to use their bodies correctly and in accordance with the principles of the internal arts leading to their healing themselves that I have seen but I think you're getting the idea.
These clear, demonstrable benefits of the correct practice of Tai Chi Chuans internal skills seem much more incredible to me than any amount of ability to hurt someone else in a staged match for profit.
That I have learned some small amount of skill at self defense can only be a bonus, as defending myself against an aggressor is yet another aspect of maintaining good health through the correct application of the skills of Tai Chi Chuan. I'm nowhere near good at the martial side of things, I need a lot more practice, but I am working on it.
Now, none of us in our little group may ever rival Yang Lu Chan in fighting skill, but we are all learning the basics of internal martial arts and learning them fairly well, each to his own measure. Since we all have lives to live and families to be a part of, none of us really have the time required to learn the entire art to the level of being able to blow chi fireballs out of our arses or anything even remotely resembling that, but those of us who have the desire to learn the martial art have it clearly available to us in as much depth as we wish to learn it.
We are told that we will get out of that area of training what we put into it, no more, no less. One hours practice equals one hours skill. No magical shortcuts or instant greatness being sold to any of us.
However it is much more the healing inherint in the art and not any show of violence that has lead me to believe in the art and study it with as much enthusiasm and time as I can.
That an extremely high level of skill in the martial arts is available through training in the internal arts is, I feel, indisputable. Those with the time and wherewithal to reach those heights certainly can if that is what they wish to do.
As for me, I will continue to struggle to keep up with what I can keep up with, continue to enjoy myself while I do it, and not spend another moment worrying about what I might be missing.
Who has time for that? I have another long form to do....