what do you think of this set ?

[Ben Gash]

Golden Arhat says "a punch is a punch", but the real problem here is that those aren't punches!! How on earth can you talk about her intent when she so obviously has none? Her shots have no direction, no energy and no focus. As I always say to my students "the end position is less important than how you got there". Obviously, if you get there in the right fashion then your end position will be good, but you can get a perfect end position with an absolutley HORRIBLE movement (such as much of that first clip).
I must agree with Mantis 108, what is the purpose of describing this as Fantzi, which it clearly isn't? If they just had open floor competition and she wanted to incorporate some Fantzi elements, then fine, but why portray this as Fantzi?
It is true, there are many bad Kung Fu performers, but the big difference is that we will acknowledge it if they're bad, we won't zealously defend them just because they'e Kung Fu guys. We might make excuses for them (after all, Kung Fu competitions tend to be more inclusive and less elitist than Wushu ones), but we won't say they're great when they're obviously not.
Golden Arhat, there was no Wushu whatsoever in that Choujiao clip, you REALLY need to do some more research on traditional TCMA, and learn that there is a world of material every bit as exciting as Wushu, but much more interesting and far more functional.
Is Wushu evil? Few things are evil in and of themselves, but it has an insidious effect on CMA as a whole, and more importantly it has ripped the fighting heart from CMA, which for many of us is unforgiveable.

[JDK]

Good comments on both sides of the "isle"
[
That little kid was great!!!!

His MMA was sick! I would be careful if that kid came at me!!!!!!

Wushu has it's place
Traditional MA has it's Place
MMA has it's Place....

IMHO

JDK

[David Jamieson]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7YRvrB0gHA
now sure the head movement is exaggerated
but if u changed that who else thinks this set is just as good if not better than most ????

martially speaking it is utterly useless in my opinion. the intention is in all the wrong places.

[firepalm]

Few things are evil in and of themselves, but it has an insidious effect on CMA as a whole, and more importantly it has ripped the fighting heart from CMA, which for many of us is unforgiveable.

wow I did not know Wushu was so powerful as to rip the fighting heart out of CMA. That's funny!

[firepalm]

A little late but nonetheless for you know who

Almost all the modern wushu forms have a forward running followed by a jumping outside crescent kick in the air.

Sounds to me like the jump outside crescent kick which originally can be found in several traditional Northern styles like Cha Quan, Hua Quan, etc...

The direction and angle make no combat sense that futher prove that the Wushu forms designer didnot consider combat situation in the 1st place.

Guess you'll have to check with persons that do those traditional styles for verification on the intended purpose!

[David Jamieson]

the thing about strikes whether they're kicks or punches is to not telegraph them.

when you run in a big circle to get momentum for a kick, you are essentially dancing not practicing martiality. In the traditional versions of outside crescent junp kicks , tornado kicks etc etc, they are generally done from one move to the next or from a standing start so to speak and are not telegraphed.

they do tend to be finishing moves though, particularly for people that are longer in the tooth.

[PangQuan]

word.

the element of suprise via explosive drive is much more practicle then running in a circle pretending your a crane

if you practice hard you can do a jumping outside crescent from any position pretty much.

[firepalm]

Classic Cha Quan routines you will notice both incorporate a run to the jump outside crescent kick

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wH5CCqAtcgc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpWELFWecvM

My point is youknowwho's implies that this run approach to jump outside invalidates wushu and thus supports his claim, when in fact the move is derived from the traditional styles

[David Jamieson]

those sets are heavy on the wushu flavour as much as they are attempting to retain the traditional set.

for instance, in the origianl form in question, it is derived from a traditional set and the wushu flair is added.

In those sets, that you just posted, they are wushuized when compared to what is in the old manual wherein there isn't more than 2 or 3 quick shuffle steps to a large kick. The big circles are a dead giveaway to the wushuification of the style while the mixing and blending is used to retain some traditional flavour while still being able to get into competitions.

also, it is fair to mention that a lot of modern wushu was ripped directly from cha chuan so it is natural that this style is going to look most like that.

[B-Rad]

Does it matter? Can't say I've ever seen a traditionalist capable of using any of these jump kicks in a fight anyway (unless you count one or two of the monks as traditionalists). If anything, they're usually even slower, weaker, and more telegraphed (from standing even!) than the modern guys I've heard of a couple guys using it in sparring competition, and both of them were contemporary wushu athletes, and even then it was completely illegal (point sparring, lol).
Anyway, the use of a technique for performance that practically no one can use effectively anyway doesn't seem that big of a deal to me. Maybe many traditional styles are flawed to begin with, or had performance elements in their styles long before modern wushu existed

[Ravenshaw]

Maybe many traditional styles are flawed to begin with, or had performance elements in their styles long before modern wushu existed

Good point. There's a definite performance element to most traditional sets. Okay, so Wing Chun is ugly as sin, but it's an exception. You know what I hear the most from people who have seen me performing sets? They don't say "powerful" or "fierce" or anything even vaguely martial-sounding. The number one word I hear when they describe it is "graceful." I put a lot of fire into my sets, but the graceful movements are what grab them. It's a good way to get students, though. People want to learn to move like that.

I don't think there's a reason to be any more bothered by wushu than by traditional stylists who just do forms. I'm not sure that should be bothersome in the first place. People simply train for different reasons. And the richness of the art and having fun doing sets is just as valid a reason to practice as fighting.