when a utopia fails

[PangQuan]

....will be the downfall of any society.

In regards to personal safety and protection, i highly doubt my ability to outhink, overpower, or out maneuver a personal agressor will be the downfall of any society.

I dont hold that much sway on the world my friend. Although im flattered by your high impression of my abilities.

[golden arhat]

i do not approve of I.D cards at all lol
but that wont matter cos the conservatives (proper conservatives not weird evil american republican ones) will get in tand they are thouroughly against
them
over all i would say that we live better here in the u.k than u yanks
we have free health care (admittedly recently the nhs hasn't been doing to well but over all its great)
a completely impartial news service
a good welfare system
the highest employment rates in 30 years (due in part to both margaret thatchers industry reforms and housing schemes and to our current labour government)

on knife crime i would say black jack is right on some points

banning knives is impossible and stupid

sticking lots of legislation to stuff doesnt solve the problem

however black jacks thinking tho logically sound (not to imply that others is not) deals only with the symptoms and not the cause

we need to tackle the reasons behind crime

most of my friends carry knives for self defense and my friend has used his as a deterrent more times than i can count, as for weither or not he could defend himself with one is a different story
trying to ban knives would be impossible when u can just go into your kitchen and get one
guns are a different story we have the ability to get rid of them for the most part here through simple better border control as no guns are manufactured here for the most part but we have to do that quickly

britain aint a utopia but its pretty nice compared to everywhere else

it does rain alot tho

[golden arhat]

But the problem Blackjack is that these are not news reports about government policy or how policy is driven in the UK, most of them are the views of private citizens.
On the given right to defend yourself, a knife isn't really that useful for self defence. If you're against an unarmed attacker, then it's HIGHLY improbable that you'll be able to argue reasonable force in self defence, and if they've got a weapon it's HIGHLY unlikely that you'll be able to free and use your own knife before you've been seriously injured. You also have the added complication of risking being stabbed with your own knife.
Why can't we carry knives? Well, because if you've got a knife then you're likely to use it. Fights over spilled drinks would routinely lead to fatal stabbings. That's hardly desirable, is it?
You haven't been able to carry a gun for self defence in Britain since I believe 1928, and gun crime has only become a problem in the last 5-10 years, so it's probably not our firearms laws that are the problem.
As for your statistics, A) gun crime in Britain is so low that it wouldn't actually take a big increase in the number of crimes to crate a 50% increase and B) New York has less violent crime than London IF you count bar fights the same as fatal shootings.
I work in the ER of our equivalent of a county general, and in the last 4 years I think we've had 3 fatal stabbings and 2 fatal beatings through the department. In total I've seen less than 20 stabbings, and half of them have been self inflicted. Compare this with the experiences of one of my American counterparts, and the difference will be stark.
Finally, I really object to someone from a country with an appalling record of civil rights abuses against it's own people, where the majority feel afraid of the police, that executes more people than the rest of the developed world put together, THAT HAS THE PATRIOT ACT!!!!!!!!getting on their high horse and making superior statements about the civil libertoes and protection that I actually have more of.

i do agree with him but banning knives is implausible it just wouldn work

i think the laws we have for knives now are good enough

we can solve gun crime through preventing them being smuggled in
our crime rate has only just gone up so we can still nip this in the bud before guns become so prevalent that we end up like the U.S

[golden arhat]

So your saying the people of the U.K. are temperamental children??

.

no hes saying that some people get drunk or angry or both
now drunk and angry plus armed is not a good idea

take into account also that teenagers carry knives more than anyone here and also get drunk and angry

so yeah some people (like everywhere) in the uk are drunk, angry, bored, tempermental and armed children (adolescents)

we need less of them

[golden arhat]

pangquan
"I am fit, and i am a survivor. Survival of the fittest, and a prosperous life to the strong" - adolf hitler

[Black Jack II]

Here come the roll-eyes......

not weird evil american republican ones

bwahahaha...whatever.

over all i would say that we live better here in the u.k than u yanks

You live in a giant nanny state with less personal freedom and no right to bear arms in the context of self defense...i dont think so.

we have free health ca

So do we. Just not the socialist brand. At least not at this point anyway.

a completely impartial news service

LMAO....complete and utter lie. Get your head out of the sand before you drown.

a good welfare system

Your proud of the fact that your country has welfare......????? Being a welfare state is bonafide bad business on many front's dude.

trying to ban knives would be impossible

Trying to ban any weapon for criminals is impossible and according to your own country that includes guns, the ignorance of some people really makes this a dead conversation, its like talking to someone who sticks there fingers in there ears and closes there own eyes.

prevalent that we end up like the U.S

Brainwashed.

You mean with a natural right to defend ourselves??

[golden arhat]

You live in a giant nanny state with less personal freedom and no right to bear arms in the context of self defense...i dont think so.

ummm no we dont dude you dont live here
our police cant go through our mail
we have cameras alot of them yes
i dont approve of that

So do we. Just not the socialist brand. At least not at this point anyway.

and the socialist brand is bad why ? it works
and why then do they ask you for money when you go to the hospital i had an ear infection in florida once they charged us $300
the free clinic doesnt count as free healthcare i'm sorry
we also get free dentist treatment if u are below 16 here

LMAO....complete and utter lie. Get your head out of the sand before you drown.

yeah man for the most part the bbc is impartial you wont find any political leanings anywhere in the bbc if u bothered to look at its reporting or see bbc news
and compared to bill O'reily we got u beat hands down

Your proud of the fact that your country has welfare......????? Being a welfare state is bonafide bad business on may front's dude.

why ?? its great it keeps people out of poverty some people abuse the system but they are caught up with eventually
if we werent having a senseless illegal war we could live even better with the taxes used to pay for that

hell why do you think half the world flocks here to work and live ??

Trying to ban any weapon for criminals is impossible and according to your own country that includes guns, the ignorance of some people really makes this a dead conversation, its like talking to someone who sticks there fingers in there ears and closes there own eyes.

hehem gun crime rose within the last 5 to 10 years
we banned personal firearms in 1928 banning guns works it just hasnt worked well recently and our gun crime rates are miniscule compared to yours per population

Brainwashed.


You mean with a natural right to defend ourselves??

we fight
we can defend ourselves
we just cant kill someone who wants my wallet though
i just dont want guns to flood our country to your extent
then banning guns would do nothing

[Radhnoti]

GA - "and the socialist brand is bad why ?"

Because it stifles creativity and eliminates incentive to improve. In every instance (save perhaps war) history and common sense shows government to be completely inferior to private industry and a free market.

Hospitals don't turn people away in the U.S., they just bill you regardless of your ability to pay.
It's my understanding that socialized medicine in Germany looks at, for example, the relative merit of giving a 60 year old treatment for cancer. I'm not comfortable with government having the power to make those kinds of determinations.

The best doctors in my town are French-Canadian. They left Canada when they realized what a rip-off socialized medicine was for truly brilliant and accomplished doctors. Why work hard to do well in Canada? The government forces you to take a predetermined amount for what you do...the SAME predetermined amount Dr. Jacques down the street makes and he flunked out of med school 4 times before finally getting a license.

Check the stats of U.S. hospitals along the Canadian AND Mexican border.
Hospitals along the Mexican border are having to close down because of the huge numbers of illegals walking in for healthcare and never paying the bill. No one is being turned away, that's free healthcare.
Also, it is my understanding that hospitals along the Canadian border are pretty consistantly full with patients seeking to PAY for superior healthcare. And where do you imagine the Canadian drug industry would be without it's ability to take the research done by U.S. drug companies? The dirty secret is that U.S. drug companies (charging U.S. citizens huge amounts) are propping up Canada's socialized drug industry.

GA - "and compared to bill O'reily we got u beat hands down".

Bill O'Reilly is a commentator, he doesn't represent himself as an unbiased newsman any more than does Rush Limbaugh. However, I do think FoxNews leans right...just as I feel the BBC leans left.