VIDEO: Kung fu used in a street fight

[zmaj]

I dont understand everybody here talking about not doing stances while fighting, to me, in everything I ever trained whatever stances we practiced is stances we used to fight and spar with. Otherwise, why bother, I think it would look really stupid to punch someone with a regular boxer like hook and then get into tiger descends mountain or something, then it looks stupid.

My worst experience with this fight western/train chinese thing was when I watched a tournament and there was so many different schools that came out and they all fought the same and it looked like just regular stuff I see when I go to bars and clubs. Only people that had some kung fu like style fighting were two different styles of praying mantis, and they definetly made my day. Great to see them do it and see people do it well and not just try to look cool with different things they can do in school.

Wong Kiew Kit has a great book out, Shaolin Kung Fu and talks about how for some reason everybody swings around like kids and all their training goes out the window while those stances were actually designed for combat, not to look cool doing your form.

And on the video just before the "gangsta" attacks, the kung fu guy clearly goes in for some kind of "jab" and once the guy goes in after him and starts swinging around there is a nice clear block too. Besides, that so called funny stance looks fairly mobile and strong if he was to sit back in it if rushed, and the ****ed back arm means lot of power from that reverse punch, because if he's got good footwork he's gonna have a decent punch too, so why didn't he punch? Hard to say, but the "gangsta" guy was already scared and backing of, so had he attacked him at that point it would have been shooting fish in a barrel, so you could even say he shows some mercy towards a weak submisive enemy.

One thing that was wierd too, I dont know if you guys noticed is that kung fu guy had to take of his shoes, and you can see him saying something like, "they'r off, now lets go", I guess they possibly tryed to to use his shoes as an excuse to chicken out honorably.

Also while he was advancing on the gangsta guy, you can hear in the background, "letts jumps this fool" but there is no one jumping in to help out their friend, and just like him they were all talk.

Now I could bet good money, had the kung fu guy just walked up to the other guy and punched him others would have been there because they would think he cant fight and its easy way to rpove them selves with very good odds. I'v seen it lots of times in school and especially on bus stops.

Well, anyway, thats my two cents on this video. :-)

[SimonM]

Thing that we are trying to communicate is that "stances" are in and of themselves a mistake. Footwork is a dynamic process. Yes, some styles of Gong Fu have distinctive footwork (I'm looking at Xingyi) but to say that you are "fighting western" if you don't fight from a bow and arrow stance is a bit... well... ignorant.

[monkeyfoot]

Wong Kiew Kit has a great book out, Shaolin Kung Fu and talks about how for some reason everybody swings around like kids and all their training goes out the window while those stances were actually designed for combat, not to look cool doing your form.

I agree

Wong Kiew Kit's book is awesome. It tottally changed the way I think about my training. I didnt read much into the forms etc etc but all the parts about training were amazing. He had a good point of not introducing a student to sparring too early on. I forget the reason, but it was basically that they haven't learnt to move and work the body like in the forms, so when they come to fight, the dominant side of being untrained takes over, and they inturn flail and forget their kung fu.

Another thing I took deeply was the whole spiritual side of kung fu. I was always a half soaked buddhist/taoist, but this book really showed me the importance of spirituality.

craig

[zmaj]

Thing that we are trying to communicate is that "stances" are in and of themselves a mistake. Footwork is a dynamic process. Yes, some styles of Gong Fu have distinctive footwork (I'm looking at Xingyi) but to say that you are "fighting western" if you don't fight from a bow and arrow stance is a bit... well... ignorant.

And whats wrong with bow and arrow stance? Great stance against take downs and it can be very quick, back in my karate days thats all we ever fought out of. It can be very quick, there is bid of a shuffle you have to practice for months before it even begins to look like it might be fast, but within a year your gaining speed and its actually battle worthy and it gets you across the dead space you have to cross.

I even got a chance to spar against a muay thai guy that was working with me at that time, so he came down to the place where I was teaching and at the end of the class we had a nice little match.

I'll admit I first learned that day that I might get kicked in the leg little too easy, which happened because it was out there for him to kick, but it took me a few secund to readjust my tactics and start working that shuffle I mentioned, and once I did every time I went into him and we exchanged blows while he was in upright posture and me in bow and arrow, he was the one backing of. Later when he'd cought on and started being more aggresive and rushing I was getting into cat stance and most of leg kicks he tryed i pulled my leg up over his kick and gave him a nice front kick to the stomach which was followed up off course.

I would say that switching stances is much better as tactic, because once you stick to something, if you opponents got any brains he's gonna start looking for a gap, so footwork is a big key to keeping your opponent guessing on how to approach you. At this case mentioned, I only used two and he was beyond confused, so off course flowing from stance to stance can not only look good but also keep you one step ahead.

That day was probably bad on my part, because 3 of my students watched us fight and had he embaraced me I could have lost them, but then again we wore face cages so smaller chance of that happening.

But anyway, in my opinion, every stance we practice is workable, before I always wondered about karate strategy's too and I always read online that muay thai is ultimate stand up and i finally had a chance to test it all out and I did more then all right.

[zmaj]

I agree

Wong Kiew Kit's book is awesome. It tottally changed the way I think about my training. I didnt read much into the forms etc etc but all the parts about training were amazing. He had a good point of not introducing a student to sparring too early on. I forget the reason, but it was basically that they haven't learnt to move and work the body like in the forms, so when they come to fight, the dominant side of being untrained takes over, and they inturn flail and forget their kung fu.

Another thing I took deeply was the whole spiritual side of kung fu. I was always a half soaked buddhist/taoist, but this book really showed me the importance of spirituality.

craig

there was a web page somewhere too, and had more stuff, almost an add on to the book, you might wanna look for it...

[SimonM]

But anyway, in my opinion, every stance we practice is workable, before I always wondered about karate strategy's too and I always read online that muay thai is ultimate stand up and i finally had a chance to test it all out and I did more then all right.

"Stances" are just tutorials of places you can put your feet. In a real fight you shouldn't be in a "stance" rather you should be moving your feet dynamically. This means that during the course of a fight your feet may occupy several "stances" as circumstances dictate. The problem is that people often think of "stances" as static and unchanging things.... and end up getting thai kicked in the knee for their efforts.

[metsubushi]

I think the guy was just a little anxious. He only punched with one arm and did the same movie like three times. So it looks like he made up his mind as to what he was going to connect with before he started fighting and tried to force the technique. As far as whether he should be in a stance or not, whatever. People seriously overanalyze fighting. The kid got in a fight, used his style, and won. That's what matters. Anything else is superfluous. It wasn't pretty, it wasn't textbook perfect, but it was effective. If he intimidated the other guy by getting into a fighting stance, way to go.