Cultural bias and "Memoirs of a Geisha"

[Jimbo]

I suppose what really bothers me is that it seems that in general, Westerners believe they can direct films about Asians, but that somehow Asian directors can't possible have the insight to direct films about Westerners. For example, pretty much nobody in America thought anything strange when Bernardo Bertolucci directed The Last Emperor; same with Western directors doing The Last Samurai, Shogun, Marco Polo, and now Memoirs of a Geisha. But when many people think of a director like Ang Lee directing non-Chinese-oriented movies in America, they usually say, "How can a Chinese direct that?" It's a very condescending attitude; on one hand, Asians are stereotyped as being over-educated and "smart"; on the other hand, we're too stupid to direct anything outside of a narrow spectrum of subjects within our own cultures.

As for "Geisha," I might see it just because besides King Kong there hasn't been anything in recent release I feel like seeing. Also because I do like Zhang Ziyi. I'm of Japanese descent but don't feel too strongly about the use of Chinese actresses to star in it. I have doubts the film would do too well in Asia. I don't agree with the filmmaker that they were necessarily the most qualified actresses to play the roles; I think they were chosen because of their fame and familiarity to Westerners, and because in the West, most people don't think there's any difference anyway.

Whew. Got that rant outta the way.

[Judge Pen]

I suppose what really bothers me is that it seems that in general, Westerners believe they can direct films about Asians, but that somehow Asian directors can't possible have the insight to direct films about Westerners. For example, pretty much nobody in America thought anything strange when Bernardo Bertolucci directed The Last Emperor; same with Western directors doing The Last Samurai, Shogun, Marco Polo, and now Memoirs of a Geisha. But when many people think of a director like Ang Lee directing non-Chinese-oriented movies in America, they usually say, "How can a Chinese direct that?" It's a very condescending attitude; on one hand, Asians are stereotyped as being over-educated and "smart"; on the other hand, we're too stupid to direct anything outside of a narrow spectrum of subjects within our own cultures.

Yo Jimbo (sorry man, I couldn't resist),

I never really noticed that particular bias. Ang Lee is one of my favorite directors; I think he brouhgt a life to those 'Sense and Sensibiltiy' that all the British directors lacked. As for films like "The Last Samurai" it was told from a Westerners perspective so the western director seemed appropriate. I had an issue with the ending of the film, but most Japanese people that I know didn't so what the he11 do I know?

I'll probably see Geisha this weekend.

[Sekabin]

Yo Jimbo (sorry man, I couldn't resist),

I never really noticed that particular bias. Ang Lee is one of my favorite directors; I think he brouhgt a life to those 'Sense and Sensibiltiy' that all the British directors lacked. As for films like "The Last Samurai" it was told from a Westerners perspective so the western director seemed appropriate. I had an issue with the ending of the film, but most Japanese people that I know didn't so what the he11 do I know?

I'll probably see Geisha this weekend.

Yeah Last Samurai went down really well in Japan. From what I hear Geisha (called "Sayuri" here) isn't doing great, but still better than expected. I might see it just for curiosity's sake, if I've nothing better to do. The cultural bias aside, I'm not sure I could stand the terrible English

[SimonM]

It's like chinese/american food really. It's not actually chinese food, it's food made for the american palatte that is made by chinese people and sold to people who wouldn't actually eat the real thing for the most part.

Such is the stuff of a good writer though. He makes you believe that this could be true! Much like Dan Brown's tales of conspiracy!

I'm not sure if I'd feel the same in the deep south (where they eat pretty much anything that isn't posionous)...

But REAL Shanxi food kicks ass!

It's like italian food only without Cheese.

Lots of Chilli, Garlic, Vinegar
Lots of Potato, mushrooms and pasta
Lots of mutton, pork and chicken

And fish... Not sure where they get the fish from... Perhaps there are Catfish in the Yellow River but Lobster is very popular in Shanxi and I don't have the foggiest clue how that got into local cuisine considering that there is a mountain range between us and the nearest ocean no matter which direction you go in.

[SimonM]

I think they were chosen because of their fame and familiarity to Westerners, and because in the West, most people don't think there's any difference anyway.

Exactly...

That and they can speak English relatively well. However there are probably hundreds of Japanese actresses and a fair share of Korean actresses who can speak English. They just don't have Ms. Zhang's drawing power.

She still is awfully pretty though...

Not quite as pretty as the Korean lass from "The Myth", Ceceilia Cheung, or my new Girlfriend (ok so I'm a bit biassed on that front ) but....

What were we talking about again?

Oh yeah, bias.... What you said Jimbo.

(So I'm having trouble staying on-topic lately, I've been through a heap of life changes in the last 6 months and I am on vacation!)

[Mr Punch]

According to the Time article I read Zhang Ziyi can't speak English. Not enough to handle the direction anyway so Michelle Yeoh had to translate for her.

Unlike Koyuki... Yuu Takada... and any number of beautiful talented Japanese actresses.

They're never gonna get the international pulling power if racist ****s like Marshall don't hire them.

And as for the internet tossers on several nationalist boards in China who reportedly said Ziyi deserved to have her breasts hacked off for playing in a Japanese story - if they're true, those ****ers want swatting.

[Mr Punch]

But REAL Shanxi food kicks ass!

Hmmm! Jealous... the Chinese food over here sucks! Except this one nice Taiwanese place I know... [/drool]

[SimonM]

Yeah well the Japanese food here isn't so great (unless I visit with Tomoko). I bet you that it is OK where you are.

[Judge Pen]

I get great Japanese food in Knoxville, but it helps when you are engaged to a really good Japanese cook.

[unkokusai]

According to the Time article I read Zhang Ziyi can't speak English. Not enough to handle the direction anyway so Michelle Yeoh had to translate for her.

Unlike Koyuki... Yuu Takada... and any number of beautiful talented Japanese actresses.

They're never gonna get the international pulling power if racist ****s like Marshall don't hire them.

And as for the internet tossers on several nationalist boards in China who reportedly said Ziyi deserved to have her breasts hacked off for playing in a Japanese story - if they're true, those ****ers want swatting.

Well said, sir.

[unkokusai]

Hmmm! Jealous... the Chinese food over here sucks! ... [/drool]

You can't find good Chinese food over in Yokohama?!

[SimonM]

Yeah well try getting good french food in England.

The two countries may be close but there are some substantial differences between how they prepare food. Hell! Within china there are substantial differences between how people from different places prepare food. And the countries are rivals. And both countries tend to be nationalistic.

It really doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

[unkokusai]

Yeah well try getting good french food in England.

The two countries may be close but there are some substantial differences between how they prepare food. Hell! Within china there are substantial differences between how people from different places prepare food. And the countries are rivals. And both countries tend to be nationalistic.

It really doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

No, no. What I mean is that there is a huge Chinatown in Yokohama (right next to Tokyo). The biggest Chinatown outside of China itself if I'm not mistaken. I've had some kick-ass food there, although I was usually drunk when I found myself in Yokohama so I might not be the most highly qualified food critic in the world.

[Mr Punch]

You can't find good Chinese food over in Yokohama?!

Kannai's food mostly sucks! You musta been lagged! You can get good stuff if you know where to go but most of it is watered down for the Japanese palate. There's a good (just about one...!) restaurant in Roppongi, can't remember the name but it has a ***** shrine in it and a large ***** shaped bell-ringer in the middle of it, with statues of peni and vaginas and what-have-you all over the walls... well, it IS Roppongi.

Nah, the best is Aji-Ou (味王) in Ikebukuro, Numabukuro or Nakano. It really is the King!

Yeah well try getting good french food in England.

Leave out the 'French' and you'd still have a point!

[SimonM]

Hey!

They do good fish and chips in England... Pub grub in general is good gnosh.