Taekwondo-Take on this do? (disliking)

[Former castleva]

Why does it seem so many are putting down taekwondo? Or is it just my...
This can often be seen at forums.I even remember a topic named "Is taekwondo any good?".
That was a different site though,but that´s about that.
I´ve got the idea that it somehow is not practical (which is not my own idea though)
So is it the case of olympic or traditional? Or is that completely a sidenote? Is it the high kicks? Or maybe something else?

It would be fancy if you would not say it is "watered down",but rather something else,anything is appreciated though.

[Liokault]

I for 1 think TKD is a great martial art.

This may be because we have lots of very good TKD teachers in Oxford.

One of my class mates and my main sparring partner is a TKD 2nd dan. He trained in a very hard club with a very good teacher from the age of 12 and now is very good and very very fast.

His kicks and straight punches and quite amazing and really hard to deal with.

He is also doing very well in san shou against kung fu guys and kick boxers.

I am not sure of the type of TKD in oxford (i think it may be olympic) but their seams to be a great deal of full contact sparring going on.

I feel the disregard for TKD on this forum may be due to the target audiance in the USA for TKD being childeren and people with to much money.




Also on a total tangent I heard of a fight involving a very good TKD teacher here in Oxford (Orello Ellis)

It apears that 4 guys took a dislikeing to him so went round to his house with a base ball bat.

One guy swung the bat at Mr Ellis whice he blocked....breaking his arm.......but he then went on to beat the 4 guys to a pulp with out the use of his arm.


I obviously was not there at the time but Oxford is a small town and I know lots of students of Mr Ellis.

[SevenStar]

I have a lot of respect for good tkd, but here are some of the reasons the style catches alot of flak:

1. over commercialism
2. the flashy kicks
3. lack of hand techs (olympic and ata styles)
4. the cammoflauge belt given in ata styles.
5. obsurd techs, like the "statue of liberty axe kick"
6. being able to progess from white to black - which consists of about 6 - 10 ranks, depending on the school) in 2 years

[chen zhen]

I don't really know if it can be called "traditional," since it's less than 50 years old.

[Lisa]

I had a bad experience with taekwon do. I took it for about a year when I was about 11 years old. I didn't learn much that would help me in a real life situation, aside from getting me in better physical shape. The stuff I learned there was all for tournaments (ie: "this is an effective technique because it's worth 2 points").

This was just my experience with that particular school, but if that's common among taekwon do schools I can understand it's reputation.

Lisa

[The Willow Sword]

Trains for the tournament,,NOT the street. i have NEVER seen someone with TKD training excel at anything other than good tournamnet point skills. TKD is VERY americanized and sportified as is alot of other martial arts out there (ie: judo, karate etc.) go to MCdojo.com and download the Muy Thai against TKD fight. you will see what i am talking about.
Many Respects,,The Willow Sword www.mcdojo.com

[Former castleva]

Thanks for your noble replies.
I think I´ve heard something similar to that americanized TKD directed towards children etc.
Nice to hear though that it had worked for that one teacher.
I´ve also wondered occasionally why it is so easy to gain a "high" level in TKD.Couple of years for a black belt,yep,I´ve heard the same.
Of course one should understand that precious 1.dan is not the end,it´s more like a sign of that you have the basics down.
There is a sad story about a TKD man with 7th.dan in his art.
One ugly day he got into a situation with a couple of average thugs,at least another them had a broken bottle...
TKD expert was killed .I think this event took place in USA.
This does not naturally prove that the art would be bad.As previously recognized,could give bad reputation though.

[truewrestler]

Muay Thai vs Tae Kwon Do

http://www.mcdojo.com/dl_goto.asp?id=5

[SevenStar]

TWS, it's no more americanized than CMA is nowadays. You just have yet to meet someone who could use their TKD training for the street...I have. Funny thing is, he trained olympic style. He's an example of what can be acheived with dedication and hard work. And sport judo will dump you on your ass just as fast as shuai chiao will.

"TKD expert was killed .I think this event took place in USA.
This does not naturally prove that the art would be bad.As previously recognized,could give bad reputation though."

this happens all the time, to people of all styles. I agree, it definitely takes credibility away from the martial arts. It should also serve as an eye opener though. make people realize that something needs to be corrected...

[greendragon]

Here in the US it exemplifies "McDojo", the most commercial of all franchise dojos. If you pay the $ you get a "temporary" blackbelt right off. As far as the "art", it emphasizes high kicking with max points given for a headshot. with these high kicks they come up on their toes, hence being called "ballerinas", no power in this type of technique. I don't think anyone would dis-agree that a high kick on the street would be a mistake. And after that roundhouse kick why do they think we don't know it will be followed by a reverse roundhouse ? Lame stuff.

[truewrestler]

high kicks have their place, but when an art is based on high and spinning kicks it isn't practical in my opinion

[SevenStar]

I agree, the high kicking can be a mistake in a fight, but that depends on the artist. you have to remember that a high level olymic tkd guy most likey has speed, agility and timing that is far beyond yours. also, he's used to counter fighting, so he knows how and when to throw his techniques.

it's no different than high level internalists that insist on using pressure points and chin na. If you have the skill and timing to make it work for you, then go for it. If not, stick to what you know you can make work.

[The Willow Sword]

i dont doubt the effectiveness of tae kwon do in its original and traditional format (hwarang) but lets face it. TKD trains for the tournament. the moment that leg goes up any higher than the waist he is either going to get grappled and taken down OR as you have no doubt seen the video truewrestler posted. CMA has been americanized as well and i agree with you on that. i just feel that if you are interested in training for personal self defense you take something that is serious, if you are interested in going to tournaments and winning trophies and such(nothing wrong with that) dont be suprised when you utilize your tournament skills on a FIGHTER you dont get the results you wanted.
its all hollywood until it gets real sevenstar.

Many Respects,,The Willow Sword

[Black Jack]

I am kind of curious as to what "americanized" means?

[dezhen2001]

I have respect for any MA, and anyone who trains hard to achieve their particular goals... no matter what style or where it came from.

Sure TKD has many competitions which have rules and things... but they are good at what they do. In a real fight sometimes u win, sometimes u lose. It doesn't matter if you're Bruce Lee, trained in 'real self defence', traditional kung fu, MMA or whatever - if someone sneeks up and hits u with a bottle from behind it's generally lights out

Many systems who have some form of full and/or semi contact training/competitions have rules for safety and other things. It allows people to test their skill and develop it. As well as have a good time. So what's the big deal? They are good at what they do, people enjoy training and it develops health. Also things like distance, timing, awarness etc. which helps in a real situation. Doesn't guarantee anything, but something is better than nothing. What would happen if a boxer clinched with a muay thai guy... obvious - differernt rules and limitations. What if the boxer was against a grappler... again different limitations. The boxer may get taken down, or he may hit the guy on the chin and it's lights out. So it's win some lose some, no matter what you train.

Of course my wing chun is much different to TKD and i have my own thoughts on what is better for 'real life' etc. but so what? i respect them for their skill in what they do

david