Interview with White Crane Master YingHan Su

by Chen Pengcheng

Nearly 370 years ago, a Chinese female martial artist named QiNiang Fang gained valuable insights from the movements of a crane and, by bringing these insights to her Shaolin kung fu, she created a new kung fu system?White Crane Boxing. She and her husband later moved to a place called YongChun, where they began to teach White Crane Boxing. Since then, the name of YongChun County has become synonymous with White Crane Kung fu in the world of Chinese martial arts. Like an evergreen tree, White Crane Boxing took root and prospered in the quiet mountainous region.

On November 20, 2006, PengCheng Chen set his feet on this legendary soil and paid a visit to the prestigious White Crane Master YingHan Su in Fujian. As a 7th Dan folk kungfu master, Master YingHan Su is a representative Chinese White Crane Master. He currently holds such titles as President of YongChun YiYun Martial Arts Research Institute, Vice President of YongChun Martial Arts Association and Executive Director of Fujian WuShu Association. Master YingHan Su welcomed PengCheng Chen warmly into his own house and impressed PengCheng Chen with his eloquence, as well as his deep knowledge of White Crane Boxing. The interview was conducted in a relaxing manner. A day and a half of talk resulted in a great deal of laughter and joy.

PengCheng Chen: How did you start your journey into the White Crane world?

Master YingHan Su: I was born into a martial art family. When I was a boy, I often heard the ancestral anecdotes of our clan. Those live stories inspired me a lot. Moreover, by then I read some martial art novels. Consequently, I often dreamed of being a chivalrous knight who went out and righted wrongs. What is more, I was weak at that time. These combined factors turned out to be the inner drives for me to learn kung fu. My actual kung fu life did not start until I met my friend who later became my sworn brother. My sworn brother had got a grand-uncle who was a celebrated White Crane master in YongChun. His name was RuiDang Pan, the fourth son of the White Crane Grandmaster ShiFeng Pan. My sworn brother introduced me to Master RuiDang Pan and he accepted me as his disciple. I trained under Master RuiDang Pan for several years and later I got another sifu whose name was LianJia Zheng. Before his return to YongChun in 1948, Master LianJia Zheng taught White Crane kung fu in Malaysia.

PengCheng Chen: Since you had two sifus, what was your first sifu?s reaction when you got the second sifu? Did your first sifu get angry?

Master YingHan Su: Actually, something happened there. After my second sifu, LianJia Zheng, returned to YongChun, he began to teach kung fu for free. He was actually one of my distant relatives. He lived quite near my house. At that time, my father had passed away, so I had to work hard to support my family. I had a big family of eight persons and life was hard in that era. My first sifu was very nice to me and in my eyes, he acted like a grandfather. However, he lived 18 miles away from me. It was quite hard for me to travel that far to his house for daily training. Because of all of these factors, I intended to learn from Master LianJia Zheng. On the first day of my training with Master LianJia Zheng, he stopped me suddenly. He looked at me and said, "You have learned White Crane kung fu before. Who was your sifu?" I first did not tell him the truth and said that I was a White Crane beginner. He shook his head and remarked, "No, no. You are not a White Crane beginner. I can see that you have learned White Crane for several years. You must tell me who your sifu is. Otherwise I will not teach you." Then he went on to let me know that the reason being that was that he did not want to offend my first sifu and it was the code of conduct that he had to follow. I then told him that my sifu was Master RuiDang Pan. Upon hearing the name, he remarked, "RuiDang Pan is a good master. I can teach you White Crane, but you must get your sifu?s permission." The following day, I came to my sifu, RuiDang Pan and explained my poor situation. My sifu RuiDang Pan gave me a full understanding that it was quite hard for me to travel 18 kilometers to his house for training since I had to work full time to struggle with my life. He also highly appraised Master LianJia Zheng?s kung fu and said that he was a true master. He also mentioned that they were friends, and they often gave kung fu performances before the public in the city of QuanZhou in the 1950s. With his approval, I then later trained under Master LianJia Zheng. Luckily enough, I became Master LianJia Zheng?s last disciple, the so-call close-door disciple. Though later I trained under my second sifu, I kept a close relationship with my first sifu. In reminiscence, I had to give my special thanks to both sifus for their unselfishness and understanding.

PengCheng Chen: Along with being a White Crane master, you are a traditional Chinese doctor, giving treatments to those patients who suffer from bone diseases. Just being curious, can I ask who taught you your medical knowledge, as I know that in the past, kung fu masters had a profound knowledge of Chinese traditional medicine, especially for bone treatments?

Master YingHan Su: It was my first sifu, RuiDang Pan, who taught me how to give treatments for bone diseases. My sifu, RuiDang Pan, was a professional kung fu coach. He lived on teaching White Crane kung fu. He taught White Crane kung fu for more than five decades in his life. Besides, he also gave treatments to the folks suffering from bone diseases. Actually, my second sifu, Master LianJia Zheng, was good at treating bone diseases as well. I inherited both the formulas and the Chinese medicine classics from them.

PengCheng Chen: When you adopt a disciple, what is your expectation? Have you got any particular requirements for such a disciple?

Master YingHan Su: First of all, I would like to say something on the differences between a disciple and a student. For those who come and train occasionally and whose purposes are for the health-keeping, I would like to group them as "students." As with the disciple, we have got several kinds of disciples. In YongChun County, the first disciple that a sifu has is called "KaiShanMen Disciple" -??-, which can be translated as, "Open-the-door-of-the-Mountain Disciple." The last disciple that a sifu has is known as "GuanShanMen Disciple -??-, which literally means, "Close-the-door-of-the-mountain Disciple." The third kind of disciple is those who train and live with a sifu for a period of long years?we name it as "DengTanRuShi Disciple," From these three kinds of disciples, only the prominent and the skillful will have the opportunity to become the so-called "ChuanRen." ChuanRen is a person who can inherit White Crane kung fu in a systematic manner.

Up to now, most of those training under me are just students. Even for those students, we have to make sure that each individual is an honest and upright person. However, it usually takes several years to gain a deep understanding of a person. Therefore, a student will have a long way to go before he becomes a formal disciple. Nevertheless, to be a disciple he just needs to go through a rite. It does not mean that he has mastered all of the White Crane knowledge. So in a real sense, a disciple refers to a person who has got a deep knowledge of White Crane kung fu, and at the same time, his moral character is worth commending. To be honest, it is now hard to get the disciples. It is mainly because most of the students do not make an incessant effort on White Crane kung fu. In YongChun, there is a widespread saying which goes, "A White Crane Master, Ten Years." This means that it will take as long as ten years to become a true White Crane master. You can imagine how hard it is to draw the students to come and train regularly. I expect that some promising talents will appear in my sight in the coming years.

PengCheng Chen: In the White Crane book that you wrote years ago, I can find such a phrase as, "Li You San Ting," which literally means that the internal energy stops at three different points. I'm confused by this phrase. Can you explain it in more detail?

Master YingHan Su: Oh, I think that you misunderstand the meaning of "San Ting" in that phrase. Actually, the word "ting" means "to accumulate," or "to gather," instead of "to stop," as you understood. Therefore, this phrase implies that the internal energy is gathered at three different points. These three different points are known as the tips of the shoulder, the tip of the elbow and the tip of the wrist. As you know, these three points are the body weapons. So when each of them is put in use, the energy should be led to and then gather in such a certain body part, in order to secure a devastating effect.

PengCheng Chen: As it is widely known, you are the founder of the YongChun YiYun Martial Arts Research Institute. Can you tell me something about the establishment of such a kung fu organization?

Master YingHan Su: The YongChun YiYun Martial Arts Research Institute was officially founded in October of 1999. It mainly focused on foreign White Crane kung fu exchange and research into White Crane kung fu. Since the first day it was established, it has received a number of martial arts teams from the west. Besides, we have been devoting our time and energy to the compiling and writing of articles and books about White Crane kung fu. We have done a lot of research into its origins, principles, and applications of its techniques, as well as collecting stories about the old masters. In addition, the YongChun YiYun Martial Arts Research Institute serves as an open window for the public so that more and more people, especially young pupils, have a better chance to learn White Crane kung fu. Here I would like to give my special thanks to my students and disciples who have been funding the institute so that it can keep running all the time.

PengCheng Chen: What are your expectations for the future?

Master YingHan Su: As you know, the YiYun Martial Arts Research Institute is in my apartment. It is a very small place. It only covers a floor space of 120 square meters. Obviously, it can not meet our needs. I am looking forward to a bigger place of our own where I can call in more White Crane masters and enthusiasts and then sponsor a bigger White Crane event. Also, it can be used as a gym for routine training.

PengCheng Chen: Up to now, how many books or videos have you published?

Master YingHan Su: Years ago, I worked with Professor ZhengFu Hong and Professor YinSheng Lin on the writing of a White Crane book called YongChun White Crane Kung Fu. That book was released in 1990. In the book, we included such contents as origin, strategies, principles and some forms. It gave readers an overall view of White Crane kung fu. Later, that book was listed by the Chinese WuShu Association as one of classic Chinese kung fu books. Since then, I have been devoting my time and energy to the compilation and proofreading of six ancient White Crane books. In 2004, these six ancient White Crane books were published in Taiwan. Last year, invited by the G.Z Beauty Publishing House and the China?s People?s Sports Audio-Visual Publishing House, I filmed fourteen bare-hand patterns and one training drill. So altogether there are over 18 discs coming out. As far as I know, these 18 discs will be released by the end of this year.

(Note: These videos were all released by January of 2007 and are available in international markets.)

PengCheng Chen: Concerning the set of six ancient White Crane books, what provided the inner drive for you to compile them?

Master YingHan Su: My sifu once said to me, "You are young. If you have got chances later in your life, please don?t forget to compile the Crane books. Should they be lost, it will be a great pity." By then, I had already trained under him for several years. However, I had never seen a single written Crane book before. Actually, I never expected a book for my "Fist," as all the lessons were taught in a rather oral way. My suspicion was later cleared away when my sifu presented to me the old Crane manuscripts. The old manuscripts were great gifts for me as they exposed me to a vast world with profound knowledge in White Crane kung fu.

My initial work on the compilation and proofreading of the old Crane manuscripts actually began before the Cultural Revolution. I paid numerous visits to the masters of that age and requested to see the old copies that they held in their possession. It was not an easy task, as some of the masters refused to share the old copies. Most of them thought that I intended to get the old manuscripts. I explained to them over and over that I just wanted to compile and then to correct the mistakes in the texts as I myself had already got one. Luckily enough, with the old masters? help and with the oral narration of my sifu, I was able to work on this project and pushed it forward in a gradual way. In 1963, the whole work was completed.

PengCheng Chen: As you starting compiling the old manuscripts before the Cultural Revolution, what happened to the corrected copies during the Cultural Revolution?

Master YingHan Su: The Chinese Cultural Revolution had a great influence on me. They took away all my weapons. Luckily, I stored my corrected Crane manuscripts in other places and due to this, the manuscripts didn?t suffer such misfortune and were able to survive.

PengCheng Chen: Master Su, you certainly have achieved a great during your deep research into White Crane kung fu. Can I ask what your next field is for your research?

Master YingHan Su: At the moment, I am writing some other stuff and I would like to make it into a complete collection of White Crane kung fu. It will be a big collection. This time I will include more contents, such as the 108 JiShou techniques (JiShou means hand fighting techniques based on Pushing Hand strategies) and more patterns. I think that White Crane fans will love it.

PengCheng Chen: White Crane kung fu in YongChun is a vast system with a lot of patterns. I once witnessed wonderful performances given by your students years ago. In addition to bare-hand patterns, I was also greatly impressed with the weapon demonstrations. How many kinds of traditional weapons are there in White Crane kung fu in YongChun?

Master YingHan Su: We have various weapons in White Crane kung fu, such as double broadswords, single broadsword, Guan broadsword (kwan do), GouLian spear, long staff, tui (a kind of long staff with one large end and one small end), cai and iron-toothed rake.

PengCheng Chen: When it comes to weapons, I recall a remark by the prestigious old White Crane Master Uncle Li Zheng, which says, "Fist is the root of Crane kung fu, while long staff can be the gem of the art." What is your understanding of his remark?

Master YingHan Su: The term "Fist" refers to the bare-handed patterns. The first half of the remark implies that bare-handed patterns are the foundation of the complete system. Besides, these bare-handed patterns are the steps leading to the weapon patterns, as there is a great deal in common between them. For instance, the long staff pattern has such fighting techniques as kun, tiao and sha, which are the same as such techniques in the bare-handed patterns as splitting down diagonally, pushing horizontally and striking downward vertically. As the same principle dominates both the bare-handed patterns and the weapon patterns, from time to time we can hear such a saying: "One should get enlightenment from the fists for the weapons, and from the weapons for the fist." Therefore, if one is good at bare-handed patterns, it will be much easier for him to work on the weapons.

With the weaponry, the wooden long staff has been widely recognized as one of the most primitive defensive weapons. Due to easy availability of a long wooden staff, it is the most common weapon not only in White Crane but in other martial arts schools as well. If one is good at long staff, one will find no difficulty with other any weapons, because any other weapon can be an extension of the long staff. For instance, when you attach a piece of sharp metal to the tip of the long staff, you make a spear. When you attach a hook-shaped piece of metal to the tip of the long staff, a GouLian spear will appear before you. As all of the weapons are governed by the same fighting principles, the elements of long staff technique can be introduced into other weapon techniques. For those who have already learned long staff, as long as they know where the sharp edge and the black of the blade are, they will soon master the new weapon. Therefore, the long staff is considered the gem of White Crane kung fu.

PengCheng Chen: In the White Crane book, there are such terms as "Wind Force," "Rain Force," and "Cloud." What are their actual meanings?

Master YingHan Su: First of all, let?s imagine a rainy day. When there is no wind, the rain will drop down vertically. When the wind blows, it brings a change to the course of the dropping rain. These are the folk sayings. So when the rain awaits the wind to make a change to its moving nature, it is called the Rain Force. When the wind blows up and totally alters the course of the dropping rain, it is called the Wind Force. Therefore, rain force actually refers to "the stillness that awaita the coming moving force," while the wind force refers to "the moving force seduces the stillness."

Both the rain force and the wind force come from the same source; that is, the Cloud, which actually means the waist. When there are clouds, there will be rain. When the clouds move, the winds blow. If energy is like a coin, the rain force and the wind force are like both sides of the coin. What makes each side of the coin is the cloud?the waist as the point where internal energy originates. The relationships among one another actually teach us how to make a good use of the opportunity in a real fighting situation.

PengCheng Chen: I read that these eight characters are crucial in White Crane kung fu: that is, xiao, die, shou, chu, zhan, zhuan, fan, and ce. Could you tell me their meanings?

Master YingHan Su: These eight characters reflect the eight fighting principles. Xiao literally means "to remove," or "to eliminate," in Chinese. So xiao can be used to deflect a coming attack and make it land empty, thus posing no threat. Die can be translated as "continually," or "nonstop," in Chinese. The die principle is closely associated with energy manifestation. It requires a continuous releasing of internal martial energy. Shou can be translated as "to draw in." Therefore, the shou principle refers to defense strategies. Chu is also translated as "to remove," or "to eliminate," in Chinese. However, it actually means to break down the so-called "bridge" formed by an opponent?s arm. Zhan can be translated as range of movement while zhuan means "to move in an arc or in a circle." Therefore, these two words actually refer to deflecting strategies. Fan can be translated as "reverse," or "opposite." The fan strategy teaches how to attack the two opposite ends of a joint. The last word, ce, means "to turn to the side." The ce principle teaches how to deflect a coming attack and let it in. These eight principles are not independent of one another. Instead, they are always used together.

PengCheng Chen: As it is widely known, the Crane systems in Fuzhou have a close link with the ancestral Crane kung fu in YongChun. However, there is an obscure notion about how Crane kungfu in YongChun was brought to Fuzhou. Do you have any particular information about the history?

Master LingHan Su: In the old days, Fujian Province was divided into eight administrative zones. There were the so-called Eight Fus. (Fu is a term for "administrative zone"). These Eight Fus were divided into two groups; that is, the First Four Fus and the Last Four Fus. The First Four Fus referred to the administrative zones around what is known as Fuzhou City today and to other places in the north and west of Fujian Province. The Last Four Fus referred to the MinNan area, which included our YongChun County. When I was young, I was told that the old masters once taught Crane kung fu in the First Four Fus. So I personally believe that the Crane kung fu in the Fuzhou area does come from YongChun County. What is more, the masters of the Shaking White Crane in Fuzhou admitted that their old Crane books came from YongChun and they claimed the old masters DaXing Wang and Zheng Chong as their remote forefathers. The old Master Zheng Chong was the disciple of old Grandmasters Zheng Li and Bai Jie in YongChun. Though there are no written records about how Crane kung fu was spread from YongChun to the areas around Fuzhou City, we can infer that it was old masters such as Zheng Chong and others of that age who brought the art out of YongChun.

PengCheng Chen: How should we understand the Crane saying, Du pi ruan ru mian, du nei ying ru tie?

Master YingHan Su: This saying can be translated as "the skin or the surface of the belly is as soft as cotton wool while the inside of the belly is as hard as an iron block." This phenomenon is the result of long practice of one's breathing exercises. White Crane kung fu asks for soft, even, and lasting breathing. When breathing in, the dan tian contracts. When breathing out, the dan tian area goes loose and qi flushes the area. This kind of breathing exercises the belly muscles and makes them hard, while when the belly goes loose, it can be very soft. Either being hard or being soft is just the influence of qi.

PengCheng Chen: What is the difference between the term duan qiao and the term li qiao?

Master YingHan Su: First of all, let me start with the term qiao. Qiao can be translated as "bridge" in Chinese. It is an important term in White Crane kung fu. It actually refers to the forearm. When a person sticks out his hand and intends to fight, we call this "setting up the bridge." If the other person fights back by sticking out his hand as well, when their hands touch, it is known as "linking the bridge." The term duan can be translated as "to break," and the term li means "to leave." Broadly speaking, duan qiao and li qiao both refer to "breaking the bridge," or "disconnecting" in modern language. However, there is a small difference between these two terms.

Suppose that you and your opponent are in the state of "linking bridges."

You can entice him in and lead his forward hand to where he will be put in the most unfavorable situation. The guiding strategy is to make him off the ziwu lin or center line, in which your opponent will find himself being unbalanced with his awkward movement. At this point, you can use that energy to fight back and move your opponent?s attacking hand off yours. This is duan qiao. However, suppose your opponent attacks you right after you two link the bridges. If your opponent is very strong, you may find it hard to directly push him off. At this point, what you need is to adopt an elusive fighting technique by removing your hands from his and applying a new fighting strategy. This is li qiao. The difference between li qiao and duan qiao is that li qiao is used when you are in the unfavorable condition while duan qiao puts you in the strong position. In particular, li qiao is used to change from an unfavorable situation to a favorable situation and then gain the initiative.

Master YingHan Su: Suppose that you are in the "link bridges" situation. If you are on the top, you may find it easy to attack your opponent. At this point, you are in the strong position. The hand on the top is like a knife while the hand below is like the meat. The knife will cut the meat and mince it. That is why we will not go under the "bridge." The latter part of the saying refers to a situation in which you and your opponent stand face to face. However, your opponent remains calm and does not launch the attack first. To start the fight, you can stick out your hand, or even make a faint movement, and see how your opponent reacts to your movement. That is what we describe when we say, "When there is no bridge, try to set up a bridge."

PengCheng Chen: How am I to understand the term shi, in such a phrase as, "Use shi to confront a coming attack" Is it a typical MinNan word?

Master YingHan Su: Yes, the word shi is in the MinNan language. Actually, when we mention shi, it goes with the other term, fa. Fa means a certain technique while shi means posture. When the opponent launches an attack, he will apply a certain technique. Therefore, fa can be understood as a single movement. When confronting a coming attack, you can use many potential techniques to fight back. So your shi, or posture, can produce a great number of potential applicable techniques. That is why the phrase says, "Use the shi to confront a coming attack."

PengCheng Chen: There is another phrase in the old White Crane manuscript which I can not understand very well. That is chen shen zhu qi -?-. What does it actually mean?

Master YingHan Su: Chen shen zhu qi is a dominant principle in routine training. The first two characters chen shen mean "to draw the waist." It requires that the cervical vertebrae and the spinal column and the coccyx should be in a vertical line. As you know, the waist is the source of internal martial energy. Any awkward movement, such as leaning forward or leaning back, inclining leftward or inclining rightward, will impair the flow of qi and then the manifestation of energy. Moreover, when the waist drops, it promises a firm stance. The latter two characters zhu qi mean "to concentrate or to keep the mind focused." Zhu qi requires smooth breathing and a calm mind. Avoid being impatient or nervous. Always try to keep a kind and pleasant countenance.

PengCheng Chen: Could you give some advice to a White Crane beginner?

Master YingHan Su: For those White Crane beginners, I think that the most important principle they should bear in mind is that they should never give way to impatience at any time. Keep calm and do kung fu as if it is a very common thing that you must do every day. Kung fu is not equivalent to various movements. People can mimic the movements quickly, but these movements are within the realm of gymnastics. However, kung fu can not be learned in a short period of time as it embraces many factors: the particular posture, speed, strength, and so on. These factors can only be obtained through long-term training. What is more, training requires repeating movements and the process can be dull. Take the Three Wars for instance; one should do it many times a day. There are no variations to this simple set of movements which may keep one excited. There is nothing but repetition.

Moreover, one should continue this dull, routine training throughout one's life. So you can imagine what will happen to a quick-tempered learner. On the other hand, White Crane kung fu is a quite soft system. At the beginning stage, all learners? movements are still or hard. It will take a long time to remove the stillness from their movements. Even when their movements become soft, they will have to push their levels to the state of hua. When they reach the state of hua, their movements become very natural and they can command their energy at will.

It is apparent that kung fu is not an easy task. In YongChun, there is a wide-spread saying: "A decade of hard training makes a White Crane Master possible." So it is especially important for beginners to remain patient.

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Written by Chen Pengcheng for KUNGFUMAGAZINE.COM

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